“There he is!”
Jonathan Del Arco greets us with a full-on bear hug and a hearty chuckle. The two of us have come together at a Burbank coffee shop one sunny afternoon to chat about his latest big-screen outing, the bittersweet drama The Grotto.
For Del Arco, The Grotto continues to build momentum on an already successful career. Having spent three decades in Hollywood, the handsome, Uruguay-born thespian first gained notice with guest spots on Star Trek: The Next Generation as the rogue Borg Hugh, and with a recurring role on Nip/Tuck. He spent 11 years playing the role of medical examiner Dr. Fernando Morales on The Closer and its subsequent spinoff Major Crimes before returning to his role of Hugh in season one of Star Trek: Picard. He followed up with the indie thriller, Borrowed, in 2022, before landing his role in The Grotto.
The Grotto sees Del Arco step into the role of Victor, the middle-aged owner of the titular nightclub living in Joshua Tree, California. As Victor mourns the loss of his longtime boyfriend Nick (Larry Sullivan), and the anemic profits of The Grotto, he has his world turned upside down by the arrival of Alice (Besty Brandt), Nick’s secret fiancé. Worse, Alice has inherited half ownership of The Grotto from Nick, forcing her and Victor into an uneasy partnership. The film marks the debut of Tony Award-winner Joanna Gleeson, best known as the Baker’s Wife in the original Broadway cast of Into The Woods, as a writer-director.
We settle in at a corner table, lattes in hand, for our chat. Del Arco giggles with excitement as we bring up the film, and ask him how he got involved.
When a Legend Calls…
MovieWeb: So how did Victor come to you?
Jonathan Del Arco: Well, I have this email. It was something I saved because I’ve never gotten such a beautiful letter as an actor. I immediately said I’d do it because I’ve been a fan of Joanna. I saw A Day in the Life of Joe Egg on Broadway. And I followed her career, obviously, as a gay man. I’m sure she wouldn’t mind [if I share it]…
Coming your way is an offer to play the male lead in my movie. I wrote it and I am directing. The role is that of Victor, the owner of a nightclub in the Mojave Desert that has seen better days. In fact, in its better days, it was a haven for the gay community. Victor is one half of the broken, beating heart in the movie. I’ve admired your work for years. But honestly, in asking to see your reel, which is a mini festival, I was truly knocked out. Your range is grand, but it was one clip of you as a transgender victim of crime that made me go back to my screenplay and enhance Victor’s story.
Del Arco: She wrote him being a former drag queen. For me. She spent 10 years writing it. People wanted to buy it from her, but she wanted to direct it. And you know, she was in her 70s, or about to be, and you know how the industry is. Are you going to give a woman some director’s job? And then she found Laure Sudreau. She’s a producer. Laure read it and said, “Here’s a check for the whole thing.” So one funder, and she already just produced that Coppola film, Fairyland. So it was these amazing people. It was just a beautiful experience. That’s the only way to describe it. A lot of us became very close friends filming it. Joanna knew exactly what story she wanted to tell. I didn’t know her until now. Now we’re friends.
MW: But back up a second, because I know, Joanna had directed for television. She’d done a lot on stage. But a first-time director in a film, no matter who this person is, it’s always dicey. Did that ever give you pause at all?
Del Arco: No, because I feel like actors that become directors inherently understand how to direct actors. Yeah, you wonder, how will they do with visuals? How will they do with storytelling? But when you read it, and you realize she’s gonna direct something she wrote so clearly. In the writing, it was very clear, the humor and pathos of it. They were very clear on the page.m When we filmed it, I wasn’t sure if that was going to pop up. I actually went to a film festival for it last weekend in Iowa.
Del Arco: And that was an incredible experience because it was a really conservative area in Iowa. And the audience was very old. And they really were moved to tears. They really got it. They got the laughter, and they really were able to understand. It made me really understand the power of storytelling to change hearts and minds. I was approached by so many people in that little town, some saying, “You know, we have a family friend who disowned their kid when they came out.” I mean, things that you and I, as people on the coasts, don’t really think about, right, that are actually happening in America.
MW: Sure.
Del Arco: So I think the film beautifully tells that story. It’s not edgy and the idea that we think of edgy films. But in a way it kind of is. Yeah.
Acting Between The Lines
MW: I think, the strongest element of the film is the performances. And this is no surprise because Gleeson is an actress. It’s the chemistry and mood and vibe with all of you. One thing I think is particularly interesting. In movies, we have background action. In The Grotto, I didn’t feel like there really was background action; there were background scenes. You see in the background, maybe the woman with a puppet, or the waiters talking. And if you pay attention to them, there’s a whole scene going on within the scene. Did Joanna instruct them? Does she give you all context?
Del Arco: Yes. She was trying to create that family atmosphere. Because at the end of the day, the movie really is about family, right? It’s very queer that way. Right? I mean, it’s a very queer film […] and they all find family with each other. The “real” family members are kind of not present or not that nice. So yes, all those things were deeply thought out, all the background scenes that were happening. She really wanted to create a three-dimensional life of the Grotto.
MW: You talked about establishing the chemistry and the family. Did you all live together?
Del Arco: We shot most of it in downtown LA in a warehouse. We shot all the interiors there. And then at the end of the shoot, we went up to Lancaster on location. I think that church has been used, I think, in Kill Bill and a few other movies. And what’s cool about it is that we shot all the exteriors later. So we didn’t really get to all hang out together till the end. And also, a lot of the actors she hired were theater actors. So it’s all beautiful, you know? Yeah. We were good gypsies.
MW: I noticed too, that she likes to use lots of business. Lots of people enter the frame, putting the thing down and moving and shifting. Tell me about shooting that way. Does that make it more of a challenge to you as an actor? Does that make it more fun?
Del Arco: I like that kind of shooting. Yeah, it is more theatrical. It’s more fun. I think it’s more fun. She does like it very theatrical, and she’s not shy about letting things breathe. The rhythm of the movie is very slow, in a good way. But I’ll say watching it with an audience, it does clip along, because it’s a comedy, you know?
MW: Let’s talk a little bit about Victor. So he’s a very cold person when we first meet him, because you find out he’s very wounded, of course, and his longtime boyfriend just died, and was actually in love with a woman. How do you approach a cipher like that as an actor? How much of a backstory do you give him? What are the conversations with Joanna?
Well, it’s interesting, because at first I was like, “Oh, my God, he’s nothing like me.’ I’m kind of a warm, chatty person, right? I had to remember that we meet him in the depths of his mourning and, and in confusion over the fact that the love of his life has this whole other life and lied to him. I think he’s just a very self-sufficient human being. And I relied a lot on the clothes that he wore. He was very like, buttoned up and scarfed up, and he was wearing a lot of coverage.
MW: Armor?
Yeah. And in the decision to how we dressed him… There’s a scene when she comes to visit my home. I wanted that to be almost maternal. I’m wearing kind of a mumu and my hair’s down. And that’s really who he is. That is the beating heart of that character; he’s a former drag queen who has kind of put on all this armor on to live a life with a closeted man.
MW: The other thing I guess I would say about him, and it’s interesting looking at this, because you shot back to back with your film Borrowed. He’s a very brooding character in many ways, as is your character, David [in Borrowed]. Both are a very far cry from Hugh Borg or Dr. Morales. These are very different kinds of roles for you. What is it about this point in your career? Are you consciously gravitating toward more brooding roles, darker roles?
Del Arco: They’re just coming to me. I don’t know why. [Laughs] I guess it’s the maturity aspect of becoming someone older and wiser in some ways. I have no idea. [In real life] I’m forever Puck. On sets, I’m stupid and silly. So it’s interesting. But now having watched the movie a couple of times I said to Joanna, “Who is that guy? I don’t even walk like that.” You know, the way he walks? Like, sort of cocky and self-assured with a sort of macho thing about him? That’s definitely not who I am. So I couldn’t answer that question. I have no idea. That is just what’s kind of coming up for me.
MW: Well, is that creatively satisfying?
Del Arco: Yeah. I love it. Because if you’re playing someone who’s restrained, all the work you have to do is really internal. And it’s a little bit more delicious, in a way, especially for film. I think the camera can capture what’s going on inside. And I find the more still performances of actors to be the more fascinating and interesting. I think both those characters are very still. Like there’s a lot going on underneath. Jonathan is hyperbolic about emotion you know. I’m like an explosively emotional person who’s playing people that aren’t. It’s kind of a really fun experience.
Loss and The Grotto
MW: One of the major themes of the movie is loss.
Del Arco: Of course, it’s all about it. Very much so and the strange friendships and relationships that loss kind of create.
MW: Obviously, this is a subject that has touched your life. Do you find yourself gravitating toward stories about loss? About wounded characters?
Del Arco: Yeah. Because I’m a wounded bird.
MW: Are you?
Oh, yeah, absolutely. There’s no way you can’t be as a queer person coming up when I did. I mean, I came out at the height of AIDS. So I did not have a traditionally joyful queer youth experience. I had to mature really fast. And, you know, my first partner died of AIDS. So there was a heaviness to my youth that I think informs who you become. I mean, it’s both a curse and a blessing to have experienced that as a young person. You definitely can identify it easier and navigate it easier. But yeah, grief and healing from grief are really what the movie’s about for me. One audience member in Iowa, the guy raised his hand. He looked like he just walked out of a farm. He said, “What do you think the movie is about?” I said, “I think it’s about loss.” And he said, “I agree with you, because I also think The Grotto is a state of mind.” And that’s what creates community, you know. They were really good at analyzing the film.
MW: Well, I think that’s a testament to you guys, that you make it accessible, and you make it interesting.
Del Arco: Joanna did. I think she made a very commercial film. It sneaks up on you.
MW: The other thing the movie alludes to, and what you were talking about in coming out at the height of the AIDS crisis, is the loss the community suffered.
Del Arco: And that was something Joanna — she’s not a queer person, but she certainly lost friends.
MW: Did you have conversations with her about that?
Del Arco: I talked a lot with her about my own loss. But also, the history of the Grotto. In the story, it was built and created for a playful community to come together to laugh and cry. I love the [flashback sequence] about the history. She shot that over a bar conversation. So it wasn’t like hyper-emotional, was just them telling Alice about the [statue of St. Bernadette]. And you’re too young to remember, but when the AIDS epidemic was happening, the gay community grabbed on to all kinds of spiritual things that were happening. Finding places where miracles were happening, or people traveling to India to healers. People were desperate.
MW: It’s also the idea. Song of Bernadette, I know is about miraculous healing. So The Grotto is a place to heal from sickness.
Del Arco: Quite literally.
MW: Now, the other thing I have to ask you about, something is going on in the queer community at the moment is dealing with this sort of merging the queer world with the straight world. In the film, that’s the idea that The Grotto is no longer going to be a queer space. It’s going to be a hipster bar. And this is something we’re seeing happen in real life. In the community right now where we’re losing our safe spaces.
Del Arco: Yeah…
A Changing World
MW: Was that anything that ever stood out to you, did you have conversations with Joanna about how that is a double-edged sword? I mean, how do you feel about your favorite gay space becoming a straight club? On some level, that’s what the movie is about…
Del Arco: Well, I think the difference is The Grotto was kind of about to go away. It’s kind of a little bit of a different scenario than imagining a gay bar that’s thriving and being sort of usurped, kinda like what’s happened in Key West.
MW: Or what’s happening in Palm Springs…
Del Arco: Yeah. It was queer Mecca. Now it’s all the best BnBs are owned by one company. That’s more about capitalism. But The Grotto isn’t about capitalism. I can imagine that there will be more drag shows now that it’s kind of getting revived. It might become more queer in a strange way with Alice and Victor running it. So it didn’t bother me in that sense. I mean, I think it’s a real issue in real life. So what’s the push-pull, right? Is it better to not be welcomed into straight culture, or to have straight culture wanting to join our culture? Because our culture is amazing.
MW: I mean, it is flattering on some level.
Del Arco: You can’t have it both ways. And so if we’re fighting to be treated equally, then I think it should play across the board in the best sense possible.
MW: Do you think we still need safe spaces?
I think that yes, of course, we do. But who’s to say that the safe space can’t include straight people?
MW: I think it depends on the crowd, frankly. Some places play very graphic gay porn for that reason. I don’t know that people go to these establishments to watch that. They go because you’re not gonna have a bachelorette party spilling all over the place.
Deal Arco: So the answer is just put onto porn? [Laughs]
MW: Or showtunes.
Del Arco: I don’t know. I’m seeing a lot of straight people liking the show tunes. I’d rather that than the opposite: what’s happening in Florida. I mean, I think the thing to really keep an eye out for in terms of our LGBTQ+ community — gay people are slightly more normalized now than they were we were 20 years ago. Trans people are now the target. I worry more about the trans community in terms of their safety. We’re living in a weird time, man.
MW: It’s a transitional time. I have many thoughts on the politics of Florida and the “Don’t Say Gay” laws, as I’m sure you do as well.
Del Arco: It’s bananas, it’s frightening. I mean, what’s happening politically to queer people, in general, is egregious. They’re putting people’s lives in danger. I’m more concerned about how we protect and allowed the T of the LGBTQ+ to thrive than a gay bar becoming a little too hetero. We don’t know what The Grotto will become. It might become more gay. I mean, Alice seems to attract gay men.
Del Arco on the Writers Strike
MW: That’s true. Now, would you like to talk about the writers strike? I know you’ve been outspoken about this. What are your thoughts on the studios not even responding to the demands of the guild? And how much havoc is this going to wreak on your own career?
Del Arco: I work in television to make my money, okay? And that’s not going to be happening anytime soon. I was driving down Sunset Boulevard a few days ago. I passed five billboards, all within each other’s eye line for that Netflix Bridgerton series. How many millions of dollars is that costing? And then not far from there, I passed four more for a Jennifer Lopez movie. But [the studios] can’t pay writers to be in a room to write? Whatever’s happened to the writers is happening to everybody else.
For people who are maybe not as familiar with the machinations of the business and those dynamics, do you feel that in simple terms, this is the same thing we’re seeing across Western society? The idea of corporate greed, of the people at the top wanting more and more and more, and just squeezing everything they can out of them?
Del Arco: 1,000%. Yeah, that is exactly what it is. It is corporations owning entities that are creative without any knowledge of how the art really happens. Art doesn’t happen by limiting the number of writers that you put in a room. That’s not how you make art. What happens to the actors in the streamer situations if they do something called “cross boarding” now, which means they’ll shoot more than one episode over a month. So they own you longer for the same amount of money.
Del Arco: So it’s all about how they can own you for longer for less. That’s the whole plot. And cross boarding is all about, how do we rent one location, have it in two episodes, so we have to shoot two episodes at the same time, but still not compensate the actor for holding them over extended period. So you receive your guest star on the show, and pay much more. You have to book out for a month. You can’t go to another job. And versions of that are happening to writers as well.
MW: So what’s the resolution to all of it?
Del Arco: I mean, studios have to cave to some degree. I think the studios have to realize they need content providers, and that they need to have a livelihood as well. A lot of artists, actors, and writers are not able to make ends meet. That’s not a good place to be in any profession. And if you live in LA, which is already hideously expensive, it’s a bad thing. It’s about mergers, corporate greed. But now we’re in the thick of it. So, gotta ride it out. Who knows when they’ll cave or how they’ll cave?
The Next Adventure
MW: You already have some stuff in the can, which is also good news. I have to ask you this, because you’re part of the Star Trek legacy. There is talk about another legacy show. You’re good friends with Jeri Ryan. She’s launched online petitions and basically publicly said she would do the Seven of Nine show.
Del Arco: I think that could happen. Yeah, I think that could definitely happen. Certainly. The strike is going to slow that process. I’m sure Paramount+’s latest financial news — I don’t think that helps matters. But I think they need this, and it would be a great one. Jeri should be the captain.
That then begs the question, would you come back?
Del Arco: Yeah, no question. I would bring that character back for Jeri.
MW: What kind of story would you like to see him involved in?
Del Arco: I haven’t thought about it. I’ve been dead since the last time I talked to you, two years ago. I just can’t even imagine what they would do with him. I have no idea what the mechanism of bringing Hugh back would be. But I’m super curious about [Hugh and Seven’s] undiscovered, unexplored relationship.
MW: So what is next for you?
Del Arco: I have no idea. I mean, I don’t have anything that I’m working on right now, obviously, because of the strike. I’m hoping The Grotto gets bought and we get some exposure. I’m available for hire.
The Grotto is currently seeking distribution and continues to play film festivals. Borrowed debuted on Prime Video on April 7.
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